Stereo Panning

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JackA
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Stereo Panning

Post by JackA »

I don't think GW has any easy tool to do this, but I'm open for suggestions. I guess I can do it in Audacity, but a little awkward. Anyway, if I have two stereo tracks, I want one track to fade as the other increases with the same content, such as panning of drums. I always thought "cross fade" was it, but I really don't know what that does. Thanks!
DougDbug
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Re: Stereo Panning

Post by DougDbug »

There is a pan effect (Effect -> Stereo -> Pan) but I think it doesn't work like a pan control on a mixer or DAW, it works like a balance control on a stereo.

A normal pan control takes a mono signal and distributes it left/right. For example if you are mixing a multi-track recording, you can pan the lead vocal to the center, one guitar to the right and another guitar toward the left.

A crossfade is where you combine two selections, overlapping and fading-out the 1st selection while fading-in the 2nd. It's similar to what a DJ does when start a new song while the 1st one is still fading-out. (Except a DJ normally uses the "natural" fade-out while the 2nd song starts normally.) Or in video, you can do a crossfade transition where on scene fades-into another.
JackA
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Re: Stereo Panning

Post by JackA »

Thanks, Doug!! I'll investigate some things you suggested, anything helps.
Some multi-tracks I found, one track is littered with little blurbs, that's where the drums pan or shift to left/right. Always thought it was done with an array of microphones, maybe sometimes, but not always.

Maybe you can buy an inexpensive mixing board that can interface with a computer, maybe it contains software. Just don't see any easy way to do it exclusively with software. Nothing on the internet, I found.

Best..
DougDbug
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Re: Stereo Panning

Post by DougDbug »

Some multi-tracks I found, one track is littered with little blurbs, that's where the drums pan or shift to left/right. Always thought it was done with an array of microphones, maybe sometimes, but not always.
With a typical studio recording, there is a microphone on each drum with each recorded to a separate track. Then, the tracks are panned as desired. (Usually the drums are panned to approximate the physical set-up, except they are often panned "wider" so that some drums are far-left and others far-right, with the kick drum in the center, etc.)

What are you working with? You said you have 2 stereo tracks (a total of 4 tracks?) What exactly are you trying to do?

If you actually have a stereo recording, maybe this will do what you want...

Make a backup file or copy your current file into a new file because I'm going to tell you to delete one channel...

- Go to Edit -> Channel -> Left. Click Copy to copy the left channel into the clipboard.
- Go to Edit -> Channel -> Right. Click Delete to silence the right channel.
- Click Paste to copy the clipboard into the right channel. You now have identical sound (the left sound) in both channels.
- Go to Edit -> Channel -> Both.
- Now, you can go to Effect -> Stereo -> Pan and pan as desired.

...Got that? The "old" left channel is now panned wherever you wish.

Repeat this with the right channel and another new file and re-pan it as desired.

Then use Edit -> Mix to create a new stereo mix, with the above panning.

Repeat with any other tracks you want to pan & mix-in.

Mixing boost can volume into clipping (distortion). So after mixing, but before saving, Maximize Volume to make sure your levels are not above 0dB.

You can also use the above technique if you have a mono track if you copy the mono data into both channels of a stereo track first.
Maybe you can buy an inexpensive mixing board that can interface with a computer, maybe it contains software. Just don't see any easy way to do it exclusively with software. Nothing on the internet, I found.
If you have digital files already, a mixer probably isn't what you want. You probably don't want to go to analog and back to digital. If you are recording and you want to set up your panning before recording, a mixer is one way to do it.

There are mixers with USB interfaces, but you'd normally use an Audio Interface which will often come with DAW Software. Then, you mix, pan and add effects with software. If you have a multi-channel audio interface you can record in multitrack. (USB mixers usually mix-down to stereo for the USB port.)

REAPER is a popular DAW for home studio use, because the license is only $60 for home or small business use. But, it's probably 100 times as complicated as a simple audio editor like GoldWave or Audacity.
DewDude420
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Re: Stereo Panning

Post by DewDude420 »

JackA wrote:I always thought "cross fade" was it, but I really don't know what that does. Thanks!
Cross-fade is the process of blending one track in to the next one; so as one track fades out, the other fades in.
JackA wrote: Maybe you can buy an inexpensive mixing board that can interface with a computer, maybe it contains software. Just don't see any easy way to do it exclusively with software. Nothing on the internet, I found.

Best..
Like Doug said, each drum is individually mic'd, usually with a couple of overhead mics. Each one is recorded individually and panned according to how the producer wants them. Sometimes you get "stems" in multi-track packages, which are just premixed elements from the master tracks.

The mixers don't contain any software. Some of them are for hardware mixing of sources and don't interact with software. Most of them are proprietary and work with specific software. The mixer in the last studio I hung around was a Protools deal; it only worked with it.

The way you'd probably do this in multi-track is boucing the audio you want to a new track and manually adjusting the pan; which is kinda what Doug explained...except working around the limitations of a 2-channel editor.
JackA
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Re: Stereo Panning

Post by JackA »

Doug and Dew, thanks for the suggestions. I don't want to elaborate on what I have - it's a gray area.
Maybe I can ask what I wish to do and maybe you can guide me.

R = Right; L = Left

Let's say, in GW, I have a single R track (Drums), I want to create another track of identical length, no content (silent). We'll call it L track.

I then want to select a segment of R track and silence it or decrease its amplitude, but I want to copy just that segment onto L track, in sync with R track. Does this sound reasonable and easy to accomplish? Then I can use the Shape (volume) control to fine tune things on each track. Then I can Stereo save both tracks and import it back with the other (binary) multi-tracks. Would be nice to be able to (highlight) save/recall that particular selection at anytime until I'm satisfied with the results.

I do feel those who do drum panning (mixing) have to separately process it. Maybe it's a dying fad, these days. Feel a lot of '70s and beyond tunes reverted back to Mono with all the available (16-30?) recording tracks.
An oddity, is listening to Van Halen and how the engineer or mixer separated the drums from cymbals by using some sort of squelch on the drum(s) track.

This is just for my own pleasure. Nothing professional, why I don't care to sink a lot of money into it.
Yes, Reaper looks a bit too involved! :shock:

Thank you both!
DougDbug
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Re: Stereo Panning

Post by DougDbug »

Let's say, in GW, I have a single R track (Drums), I want to create another track of identical length, no content (silent). We'll call it L track.

I then want to select a segment of R track and silence it or decrease its amplitude, but I want to copy just that segment onto L track, in sync with R track. Does this sound reasonable and easy to accomplish?
Yes. But, if you are working with segments, it will be easier to keep the left & right channels in-sync if you work with stereo files and simply copy between left & right.

Or, you might want to copy the whole file (to keep it in sync) and then silence the parts/segments you don't want.
Then I can Stereo save both tracks and import it back with the other (binary) multi-tracks.
You lost me with the multitrack stuff... If the above tracks are mono, you can copy them into the left & right channels of a new-silent stereo track. (Just go into the edit menu and select the track you want to paste-into, one at at time.)
Would be nice to be able to (highlight) save/recall that particular selection at anytime until I'm satisfied with the results.
There is a "preview" button for most (all?) of the effects, and you can un-do anything as long as you have not saved yet.
JackA
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Re: Stereo Panning

Post by JackA »

Doug (thanks!), I'm working with a mono drum track, but want to fabricate another track with bits and pieces of the mono drum track. This way, I can create the stereo panning (or the effects) I need.
I just tried, for the very first time, using the Marker control, where I can save and recall a selection. I think that is what I need!!

A crude example what I want can be heard here, (starting) at about 0:22 secs., with the bass drum. Not what I'd call panning, but displacing the bass drum....

http://www.angelfire.com/empire/abpsp/i ... her-k1.mp3
DougDbug
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Re: Stereo Panning

Post by DougDbug »

Sound's good Jack!
GoldWave Inc.
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Re: Stereo Panning

Post by GoldWave Inc. »

JackA wrote:I then want to select a segment of R track and silence it or decrease its amplitude, but I want to copy just that segment onto L track, in sync with R track.
You can select the segment, then use Effect | Stereo | Channel Mixer. You can set the left channel to have 100% of the right channel and set the right channel to any volume you'd like. No need to copy and paste and it's always in sync.

Chris
JackA
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Re: Stereo Panning

Post by JackA »

DougDbug wrote:Sound's good Jack!
Thanks, Doug. It's just a shame I can't get anyone to write about these "multi-tracks", in a music related publication. Many untold stories could be told. For example, The Romantics sued others (studio musicians?) for recording their, "What I Like About You" (to create multi-tracks), since it was so close to the original hit, but better sound quality, too.

Like, here's Paul McCartney overdubbing his bass guitar to his hit, "Jet". I'm sure whatever music you may hear is coming from his headphones. Paul really gets into the song (his bass did little for the song, track may not have been included)....
http://www.angelfire.com/empire/abpsp/i ... t-bass.mp3

Thanks, again!

Jack
JackA
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Re: Stereo Panning

Post by JackA »

GoldWave Inc. wrote:
JackA wrote:I then want to select a segment of R track and silence it or decrease its amplitude, but I want to copy just that segment onto L track, in sync with R track.
You can select the segment, then use Effect | Stereo | Channel Mixer. You can set the left channel to have 100% of the right channel and set the right channel to any volume you'd like. No need to copy and paste and it's always in sync.

Chris
Pretty nice tools you built into GW!!

Footnote: Your nice software has gained me countless hours of fun, entertainment and nice sound over a decade! I'm a true believer in digital mixing and audio enhancing - no electronics "noise" in its way. I purchased the Band On The Run CD album with a "Bonus" (re)mix of Band On The Run - not a thrill at all. So, I remixed it to what I like. It's what I call a "static" mix; no mixing console involved; audio enhanced in GW. A HD Radio station wanted a copy...
http://www.angelfire.com/empire/abpsp/i ... un-rmx.mp3

Nice work, Chris!

No longer do I have to sit on the porch, I can now run with the big dogs! :P

No reply,
thanks!

Jack
JackA
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Re: Stereo Panning

Post by JackA »

zuqiu321 wrote:If you actually have a stereo recording, maybe this will do what you want.
Remember Led Zeppelin?
Need some work?! I need that guitar hard panned, left/right (as the stereo version is):
http://www.angelfire.com/empire/abpsp/i ... nippet.mp3
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