Multichannel Mixer Channels Question (Stereo to Multi)

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brunoxi
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2018 3:33 am

Multichannel Mixer Channels Question (Stereo to Multi)

Post by brunoxi »

Hello there. I have a 6 (5.1) channel test file that pans from FL to FR and then back every 10 seconds or so. I am trying to create a "super wide" stereo filter as I find the "Stereo to Multichannel" built-in default doesn't seem to go wide enough. In trying to create my custom filter, I was not getting the wideness I was expecting, so I tried seeing if there was a possible bug (or perhaps I'm just doing it wrong) in how the volumes are calculated. In this test, I focused on two channels only and changed the values to the following:
  • FL = 0FL/100FR
  • SR = 100FL/0FR
What I noticed is instead of expecting the Surround Left to be blasting the left channel until it faded out and then the Front Left to blast the right channel, that it instead it just seemed that the Surround Left was duplicating whatever Front Left was playing. So instead of the channels swapping/panning every 10 seconds, both channels were only audible every 10 seconds, followed by 10 seconds of silence (effectively only playing the right channel anyway). I am wondering if this is a bug.

How is this supposed to work? Am I approaching this wrong :? ? (If an image would be easier to show the example, I could probably link one)

Thanks!

EDIT: Forgot to mention that I am on GW6.32 on Windows 10
DougDbug
Posts: 2172
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2005 3:33 pm
Location: Silicon Valley

Re: Multichannel Mixer Channels Question (Stereo to Multi)

Post by DougDbug »

The multichannel mixer simply mixes/pans the channels. You can "move" everything into to the front-left or you could swap the left & right, etc.

I'm not sure what you mean by "super wide"... Of course, you can't pan-left past the left speaker. If you want to go "wider" you'd have to move the speaker.*

•FL = 0FL/100FR = Move front-right into front-left
•SR = 100FL/0FR = Move front-left into surround right
What I noticed is instead of expecting the Surround Left to be blasting the left channel until it faded out...
You are not showing surround-left (or front-right) at all! There are 36 faders and you are only showing 4.



* There are "widening" effects but I don't think there's anything like that built into GoldWave. One simple way to do it is to select one channel for editing and then Invert it (Effect -> Invert). But that only works when sound is playing through both speakers… It doesn't do anything with hard-left or hard-right panned sounds and it doesn't do anything with headphones. And it kills the bass because the bass soundwaves are canceled-out in the air (or canceled electronically if you have a subwoofer), and if you play-back on a mono system it works like a "vocal remover" and it kills everything in the center. ...In general, these "artificial widening" effects can mess-up the sound.
brunoxi
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2018 3:33 am

Re: Multichannel Mixer Channels Question (Stereo to Multi)

Post by brunoxi »

You are not showing surround-left (or front-right) at al..
I understand what you are getting to, thanks. So if I'm looking for something like the following where I take an original stereo audio track and want it to be "super-wide" as in the definition of:

Code: Select all

SL = 100L% - 75L%  balance from left audio track
FL =  75L% - 25L%  balance from left audio track
 C =  25L% - 25R%  balance from both audio tracks
FR =  25R% - 75R%  balance from right audio track
SR =  75R% - 100R% balance from right audio track
Would it make sense if instead of saying "super-wide", that it's more of a "wrap around"? In essence, the furthermost left balances would instead be sent to the surround speaker & same for the right so that it "wraps around the listener".
DougDbug
Posts: 2172
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2005 3:33 pm
Location: Silicon Valley

Re: Multichannel Mixer Channels Question (Stereo to Multi)

Post by DougDbug »

I have a 6 (5.1) channel test file that pans...

…where I take an original stereo audio track
If you are starting with a 2-channel stereo track you should make a new 5.1 channel track and copy the stereo file into it. Then you'll have all 6 channels to "play with" and you'll see the full multi-channel mixer.
Would it make sense if instead of saying "super-wide", that it's more of a "wrap around"? In essence, the furthermost left balances would instead be sent to the surround speaker & same for the right so that it "wraps around the listener".
If you want to make it "non-directional" or "all-directional", start by mixing all channels equally... If you've got a 2-channel file, just mix 50/50 into all 5 channels. Then give it a listen. If your original is 5.1 channels, mix all 5 channels equally into all 5 channels at 20% each.

You'll have to experiment from there... You'll probably have to reduce (or completely kill) the center. (With regular stereo, identical left & right channels creates a "phantom center" and adding a center speaker will only reinforce that illusion, making the center "tighter" rather than wider.)

In most home theater systems the rear channels are delayed, so if all channels are equal your brain will tell you the sound is coming from the front. If that happens, lower the volume of the front channels until the direction is less-defined.


P.S.
For an easier experiment to start with, make a true 1-channel mono file. Then mix that equally into all 5 channels (or just the 4 corners) of a new 5.1 channel file. If it seems to come from the from the front or behind, reduce the dominant channels until it becomes more vague.
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