Needle drop 'skipping'

[mrsoul]

Hi,

I am attempting use Goldwave to make high rez copies of my vinyl collection.Unfortunately on certain songs it skips.....not like a needle moving but like a fraction of the song is missing and it just goes on to the next part-we are only talking a second or two of music.

Also,in between songs there is often no gap-it just jumps straight to the next tune but it sounds rushed.

The vinyl all play fine when I am listening to them normally.Is there some setting I have on? Is it maybe some compression or something that won't record parts of very low or zero volume? It does seem to affect quieter songs more than loader,full band stuff?

It's very odd.

[Tristan]

Hi,

I am attempting use Goldwave to make high rez copies of my vinyl collection.Unfortunately on certain songs it skips.....not like a needle moving but like a fraction of the song is missing and it just goes on to the next part-we are only talking a second or two of music.

Also,in between songs there is often no gap-it just jumps straight to the next tune but it sounds rushed.

The vinyl all play fine when I am listening to them normally.Is there some setting I have on? Is it maybe some compression or something that won't record parts of very low or zero volume? It does seem to affect quieter songs more than loader,full band stuff?

It's very odd.

I had a problem with pauses during recording with Goldwave. I could never find the cause. I've since reconfigured my computer to make it more audio-friendly (i.e. deactivated Windows Defender, reconfigured some other processes and services), but I haven't tried recording with Goldwave again. The integrated audio circuitry is, for me, more reliable for recording than USB audio, even under the best of circumstances, but I don't feel like trying to use Realtek technology to try to make high-quality recordings. I've long since moved on to outboard digital recorders.

I don't know what your recording set-up is. If you have a USB interface, you might try switching to exclusive mode in Goldwave if you haven't already. Windows Defender is as real resource hog. I recommend using Bitdefender instead. As for other things -- you might just have to experiment. Sorry if that sounds lame.

As for the lack of a gap between songs (Do you mean just during playback, meaning that the gap is recorded but not played?), I don't remember having that problem. Even so, problem 1 and problem 2 might be manifestations of the same, underlying issue. You might be able to kill 2 birds with 1 stone.

[DougDbug]

it maybe some compression or something that won't record parts of very low or zero volume? It does seem to affect quieter songs more than loader,full band stuff?

Go to Options -> Control Properties -> Record and make sure Level Activated Recording is not selected.


FYI - You don't need "high resolution" for vinyl. Real-world vinyl resolution is limited by the noise, and obviously your hearing is better than vinyl because you can clearly hear the noise (and sometimes you can hear distortion and frequency response variations). On the other hand, CDs (44.1/16) are better than human hearing so you don't need anything better.

Copying vinyl records to high resolution audio is like copying your VHS tapes to Blu-Ray... It doesn't hurt, but you don't get Blu-Ray resolution/quality.

[mrsoul]

Thank you very much for the reply.

I'm really not that technically minded to be honest and i'm fairly new to recording but I will definitely give your suggestions a try.

As for the gaps between songs,I would have to check up on this but it's almost like the silence is not recorded.....the fade out's are very abrupt.

[mrsoul]

[quoteFYI - You don't need "high resolution" for vinyl. Real-world vinyl resolution is limited by the noise, and obviously your hearing is better than vinyl because you can clearly hear the noise (and sometimes you can hear distortion and frequency response variations). On the other hand, CDs (44.1/16) are better than human hearing so you don't need anything better.

Copying vinyl records to high resolution audio is like copying your VHS tapes to Blu-Ray... It doesn't hurt, but you don't get Blu-Ray resolution/quality.][/quote]

Thank you for your reply-I really appreciate it.In regards to the quote(and with all due respect) I have to disagree with your statement.

For me personally,a well mastered vinyl record beats everything else sound wise. Capturing it in high rez does not reach the same peak but the recordings I have made so far(apart from the aforementioned problems) get me pretty close(and FAR better than CD quality).

The analogy you used regarding VHS imo doesn't work because VHS audio is inferior than Blu-ray audio,whereas(imo) analog vinyl(in many-not all cases) beats blu-ray.

Having said that,I have downloaded other peoples high rez vinyl rips that are better than mine.I am going to assume they have the luxury of a superior set up than me.

I would be happy to send you some samples if you have the capability to listen to high rez files through some decent speakers to see whether you agree?

[mrsoul]

Ha ha,as you can see I have not worked out how to quote properly on this forum-sorry!

[mrsoul]

Dougdbug-you were absolutely right,level activated recording was selected-thank you so much!!!!!!!

[DougDbug]

Having said that,I have downloaded other peoples high rez vinyl rips that are better than mine.I am going to assume they have the luxury of a superior set up than me.

Their records may be in better condition, they may have different/better recordings, and they may be doing some digital processing. GoldWave has a Click/Pop filter as well as a regular noise reduction filter, and there are other specialized applications for cleaning-up vinyl recordings. I have Wave Repair and Wave Corrector (both are affordable). Wave Repair only "touches" the audio where you identify a defect, but it can take me full-weekend to clean-up a digitized record. (I only digitize vinyl when the recording is not available digitally.)

They may also be doing some EQ. Since I'm usually digitizing older dull-sounding recordings, I often boost the highs a few dB.

Otherwise the biggest difference between (good quality) turntables will usually be the frequency response of the phono cartridge. It's also possible to have a mechanically noisy turntable (rumble), or speed problems, or a noisy preamp (there's almost always some audible noise from the preamp). But usually, the limiting factor is the record itself and I'm sure you've noticed that some records sound better than others.

For me personally,a well mastered vinyl record beats everything else sound wise. Capturing it in high rez does not reach the same peak but the recordings I have made so far(apart from the aforementioned problems) get me pretty close(and FAR better than CD quality).

The analogy you used regarding VHS imo doesn't work because VHS audio is inferior than Blu-ray audio,whereas(imo) analog vinyl(in many-not all cases) beats blu-ray.

Some people prefer the sound of vinyl, and that's fine, but technically (noise, distortion, frequency response, dynamic range) digital is superior to analog.

I grew-up with vinyl, and even in those days I hated the "snap", "crackle", and "pop". And back then, most new records were mediocre sounding even before they "developed" clicks & pops. Once in awhile you'd run across a gem. After I got my 1st CD player, I never bought a record again...

I wasn't talking about VHS audio, but interestingly, VHS Hi-Fi was the best consumer sound available at the time, beating records and cassettes (again the going by the technical specs).

And, the guys who've done scientific, blind, level-matched ABX Tests have pretty much demonstrated that you can't hear the difference between a high-resolution original and a copy downsampled to CD quality. You can do those tests yourself.

In fact, a high-bitrate MP3 can often sound identical to a high-resolution original... MP3 is lossy and we've all heard lousy low-bitrate MP3s, but you'll probably be surprised how hard it is to hear a difference with a good-quality MP3 (in a proper blind listening test).

[Tristan]

At any rate, I'm curious to know if any of the suggestions resolved the recording issues.

[DewDude420]

I gave up on PC based recording years ago. Yes, it's nice and handy; but a PC is prone to too many issues recording wise. My suggestion...which is probably not a very popular one; is you move recording entirely away from the PC and in to some kind of dedicated device.

The first thing this does is remove the PC from the picture. You don't have your sound software competing for CPU time with other background processes. I had a couple of recordings where, for whatever reason, chunks of audio would just disappear. This was with what was supposed to be a relatively good quality USB sound device; which this wasn't a great trade-off when compared to an internal PCI card...which could be rock solid reliable...but was in the noisy environment of a PC.

Granted, the situation has changed a bit; the cost of a good quality USB device that does high-resolution digitization is about the same or not much less than say a small Korg recorder. This gives you a couple of advantages; first of all they're pretty good quality recorders; they're also dedicated recording hardware. You won't have any other processes that could possibly screw things up. There's no USB bus that could possibly cause jitter...and you'll probably have a much more accurate clock for your ADC to run by.

It also means you can keep your turntable in a suitable enviroment...free from as much vibration as possible...rather than hauling it to the same room as your PC. Of course..the main reason my method involves Korg recorders is I digitize my needledrops to 1-bit DSD as opposed to PCM.

But your recording setup and problems have nothing to do with why other people's rips sound better/different than yours. That's largely because vinyl is such a finicky playback system that almost anything can affect it's sound quality. The exact cartridge you use, the cut of the stylus, the alignment of the cartridge, the tonearm material, tonearm shape, the quality of the LP to start with, now well you cleaned it, how well everyone cleaned it before playing it before you, what it was played on before you got it, how much tracking force you use, the alignment of the poles.....and that's not even getting in to subtle differences between preamps and ADCs.